Tiger Woods plays his irons in weaker lofts and he doesnt seem to have any distance issues! The only way you would see a difference is if you put them side by side with another set of Ap2's that are not bent. Started Thursday at 03:24 PM. Here are some of the facts, and fallacies, about club adjustment. He is also 1 of 33 TrackMan Masters in the world, and has completed thousands of successful fittings using TrackMan. Below, you'll see the results. Sorry to be a jerk but this topic comes up quite regularly so there are dozens of threads in the archives discussing this same topic. Weakening lofts makes zero sense to me. The palms should be aligned, that is so that the two Vs formed by your thumb and forefinger should point in the same direction, whether a bit weak or strong from the neutral position. So, if you really want to get better at golf, start by learning how to hold the club properly. If the hosel design and manufacturing processes allow it, the lie of an iron can be bent 3-4 degrees or more with no compromise to the integrity of the head. Plenty have broken their duck here, and now the Puerto Rico curse has been resigned to history lets get with a couple of players who have their best days in front of them. But there is a lot more to it than that. 00bolt, September 12, 2016 in WRX Club Techs. Callaway Epic - HZRDUS BlackCobra F9 3 Wood The club only has .5 degrees of bounce as it is. Then if your wedge gaps are off you might tweak them a degree. Hes happy to answer any of your questions! Everyone's comments are super helpful! The sole on that thing is tiny compared to any driving iron and I still had no trouble hitting it off the deck. How Long Do They Last, Driving Iron Advantages and Disadvantages, You are using clubs that are too tall for you (easy fix is to change the shaft length), You stand far away from the golf ball when making a swing. I knew that bounce and loft have a 1:1 ratio but never thought that changing lie angle would affect swingweight but it makes perfect sense. Equipment counts courtesy of Darrell Survey. Thanks for everybody for your help! But if your best place for improvement is in your approach shots or play with the long clubs, you simply must work on your fundamentals of the golf swing. LOWER COG IN NEW IRONS REQUIRES LESS LOFT A LOT OF THE TIME TO GET THE SAME DISTANCE OF OLDER CLUBS WITH A HIGHER COG. As long as the spin rate is acceptable, the new irons, because of their lower center of gravity, are going to produce more speed off the face (due to the lower loft and lower COG) and more distance. I use Ping I Blades and Ping have a 'power spec' on their website for these where the lofts can be bent to and still retain playabilty. How will that affect it though? We dont stop playing the game because we get old; we get old because we stop playing the game.. PING Forged wedges The MB and CB clubs you have need a bit more loft to get the ball launched well. There are however a few key points that golfers need to know about changing the lie angle of their club so that they can get the most out of their club. Show Your True Colors With Mitchell Golfs Custom Color Program. I was thinking of bending my irons 3 degrees stronger as my ball flights were too high, but then there would be a big gap to fill between the pitching wedge and the gap wedge, and potentially more side effects of bending the clubs then. Here is a quick list of scenarios that might mean that you need to use a flatter lie angle in your clubs: On the flip side, here is a list of situations that might require you to get a more upright lie angle: The best way to get your loft and lie adjusted is by a professional club fitter. Titleist U500 3 & 4 Oban Kiyoshi Purple Tour Reserve I do not disagree with you on the long irons Drew, we have hybrids to replace those. If you think about it, a flatter lie would be toe down for your swing. Even with limitations, many of todays metal woods are indeed bendable, especially stainless-steel heads. 4-6 more yards (depending on club and swing speed) and lower launch with less bounce. Theyre selling the clubs by saying that you will hit them longer, yet like you said, many of those whod need the help arent really hitting at least the longer irons any longer. Will the clubs dig more or enough to tell a difference? I know my distances with the Ping set too well and I dont want to go through a whole season of trial-and-error with new irons, so would it make sense to have my new Mizuno irons bent to the old Ping specs? And provided the hosel of the wood is long enough to allow the bending bar to fit over its length, metal woods can be bent to custom-fit a player. How much of static bounce is positive at impact?..we have to start from a static bounce of MORE than the difference to have any, and 31* minus 20.2* = 10.8 static bounce is needed to get ZERO. What do you mean about not seeing any changes in your irons? At a club fitting it was pointed out that I had about a 0 aoa and was launching a bit higher than ideal. Novak has made five cuts from seven starts since qualifying, with the most significant results being 17th in Bermuda (another wind-affected coastal course) 12th at the much higher-grade Sony Open and 29th at last weeks Honda Classic. I changed my Apex pro 19 2 degrees strong. When you start messing around with the hozzels and stress on clubs you need to know what you are doing. * MD4 54/10 S-Grind replacedMD3 54/12 W-Grind. Thanks for the insight! As far as lofts for amateurs go, I feel like long irons have to little difference between them. Vokey 54.10, 2009 58.12 M, Testing TM MG2 60* TW grind and MG356* TW grind. Equipment counts courtesy of Darrell Survey. All rights reserved. Anyway, the scorecard couldn't care less what club you hit. Your previous content has been restored. Hi all, I was wondering if bending a club 2* strong would affect the playability of said club? Add loft for distance?????? Not only does it mess with the bounce/offset, but it's only a number on the sole if the club. Here are the different ways fitters change the lie angle of a club: A club can either be bent to an upright position (toe higher than heel) or flat (toe lower than heel) usually in increments of 1 or 2 degrees. Pasted as rich text. So if you have the time, watch this cool video that I really like explaining how important lie angle is for your golf game: Having and knowing the correct lie angle of your clubs will be a game changer, I promise! Its not about research or information, its about ego and emotion. Ultimately, your answer is yes, you can do this. Calla SuperHot (Orange preferred) ||Bag: Sun Mountain Three 5 stand bag. Working through the grades, hisdebut, five-shot victory on the KFT,was backed up with a pair of top-10s and two-top-20s, easily enough to nab his PGA Tour card for 2022/23. ProV1x-mostly. Ping G400 Max driver w/Aldila Rogue 125 Silver Best of luck.Chuck. Check out the different lie angles of a standard 8 iron from these three companies: I know that the difference between these angles doesnt seem like much. Srixon Q-Star Tour / 2. Great answer Blake. Yes, I'm a club gigolo. GolfWRX_Spotted posted a topic in Tour and Pre-Release Equipment, Tuesday at 04:47 PM, GolfWRX_Spotted posted a topic in Tour and Pre-Release Equipment, February 20, GolfWRX_Spotted posted a topic in Tour and Pre-Release Equipment, February 13, GolfWRX_Spotted posted a topic in Tour and Pre-Release Equipment, February 6, GolfWRX_Spotted posted a topic in Tour and Pre-Release Equipment, January 31, By weight removed), (face-balanced) + Evnroll Gravity Grip | SeeMore FGP + SuperStroke 1.0PT. High bounce irons absorb a change like this more easily. Hope this Helps! When looking for clubs that fit your game, a professional club fitter will look at these factors down below to determine what their lie angle should be: I know this concept can be confusing, especially if you have never been fit for golf clubs before. On the opposite and gapping from AW to 9i is very wide about 16 yards about between clubs. If you're after a driving iron, I would expect you to use it off the tee for the most part. By NYonce. Unless of course it's a long iron and you have a hard time elevating it in the first place. On a driver? The reason this happens has to do with an irons center of gravity (COG), because when you lower an irons COG you add a lot of potential height to a golf shot. Lets assume that the launch angle with a modern-lofted set of irons is ideal. i dont need that. 10.5 set at small - Are you above or below average for some or all of these statistics? So I hit my standard 50 yard pitch with a 54* wedge. Titleist does recommend no more than +/- 2 degrees from factory and you should be ok. Any more and there is a risk of the stress cracks in the hosel area (primarily cosmetic). More photos from the event here. Your previous content has been restored. If they are not bent properly you can change the lie fairly easily unintentionally. The new era of stronger lofts is all about how far to hit 7 iron vs how close to hit 7 iron and more accurate. Ping Glide wedges w/Recoil 110 Training Aids, GPS Devices, Apps, Accessories & More. ** Due to coronavirus and the work restrictions in place here in Michigan, for international orders, please email info@mitchellgolf.com for a complete quote. The industry is run by marketing divisions, who are responsible for stronger lofted irons, in the mistaken belief that lower loft equals more distance. Might actually help on hard ground. Undershooter And here is why. That said, people will usually launch clubs higher with a longer shaft length as well, (mechanical advantage/physics) so again, it kind of goes hand in hand with the stronger lofts. Restore formatting, I would never ever think of doing this on my own. If anything I am a digger in the golf swing. You can easily bend the lofts and lies to be progressively consistent from one club to the next with zero tolerance. SW: 56* Scratch Tour Dept(CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold SpinnerLW: 60* Scratch Tour Department (CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold SpinnerXW: 64* Cally XForged Vintage w/ DG X100 8 iron tiger steppedPutter: Nike Method Prototype 006 at 34"Have a ton of back-ups in all categories, but there are always 14 clubs in the bag that differ depending on the course and set-up. Well gee, I guess if you cant get a 7 iron in the air, you really do need some help haha. This will give you a low-to-mid-range straight shot. What I havent seen mentioned is that iron shafts have changed a great deal and offer more low kick (higher launch/spin) options to be able to match with those lofts. I wouldn't feel comfortable messing with the bounce/offset/loft. First, is it safe to have P790s bent that much? Everyone tries to boast yardage, not consistency and accuracy. Ping Redwood Anser- the "real deal!". Should I see any difference in 1 degree stronger irons? Yes, thats essentially what Im asking. Novak has finished 11th after the first round in Hawaii, fifth at Torrey Pines and in the top-30 at Pebble Beach and at the Honda. Ping G425 5 wood & hybrid I was a little worried I might notice the offset or have trouble with hitting them fat, but they look perfect and play like they should. This is a dumb question but were you fit for them? This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. All rights reserved. By Greyson P. I just purchase a great used 712 AP2 set. I should have made the same swing with a 9 iron, to compensate for the lie, but did not.". Simply put, bending the iron 6.5 degrees strong wasn't an option. After this long introduction, Nick keep preaching this gospel. This is especially true of clubs made with long hosels. TM Spider Mallet w/ Carbon insert Not fact but I do think more offset makes it easier to draw the ball. Some people prefer a higher or lower, high- or low-spin ball flight for strategic purposes. Bounce follows loft in a 1:1 ratio. 3" = 4.6* and 6" = 9.2* change in loft. Whether its changing the lie to improve accuracy or changing loft to make sure that the players clubs are progressively consistent, angle bending is a major factor in club performance. Using like say an Older Macgregor blade butter knife with a thin sharp leading edge on the sole if you deloft more than 1 degree or so you have a chance of digging to China. It just depends. After the back-to-back top-25s, he was a sneaky play at a long price for the Honda, but was never comfortable, withdrawing during the event with sinus issues. 4-AW with juiced lofts is the same set as an old 3-PW that would probably be 22*-48*. Sounds like it's a long iron. By Introduce Yourself/ WIYB (What's In Your Bag), Lessons, Drills, Mental Game, and Fitness Tips. Step 1 for those golfers is to increase ball speed. My advice would be to start by making sure the lofts are set to manufacturers specs. Featured Section: A golf club can be bent two degrees flat when the lie angle is lowered and the heel of the club is raised to a position that is higher than the toe of the club. Paste as plain text instead, I reckon for every 1 degree off it takes about 250 off the spin. Copyright 2022 MyGolfSpy Loft and lie changes are more or less permanent. Where Can You Get Your Lie Angle Adjusted, Should You Use Heavier Shafts in Wedges? I was 50 yards out on the 3rd hole, and was in the moguls. The bend overlap in angle iron will be bigger so you need to allow for a 1/2 inch. I was fit for my current irons and they were bent 2 degrees strong for ball flight purposes. Yes, it is possible to bend the irons 1-2 degrees stronger, but by doing so you would be reducing the effective bounce on the clubs. I know it will increase the bounce. If you can get it in the air, no problem. Youll be amazed at the difference a properly fit set of irons can make to your game. The bounce will be irrelevant to begin with in that case anyway. 5 Testers Needed! This feels like an anyone week the back-nine on Sunday could be fun. A lot of mixing and matching I'm not so much of a digger with long irons, and I thought about getting my rogue 5i bent a degree stronger and not carry a 4. The 2-degree limit is only recommended when changing the lofts on irons due to the potential effect such bends will have on the sole angle of the club. *Performance average removes all outliers good and bad, to give a distance based on how far a well struck shot will go. Good luck! If you are taking big divots with a 2 iron you have some serious problems with your swing. Will bending irons 2 degrees strong promote more of a draw ball flight? Paste as plain text instead, I've had plenty of clubs bent a degree or two and never had an issue with how the clubs performed, even a wedge. Its like that distance is just not filled. More ball speed helps them keep the ball in the air longer, which raises their maximum height. High bounce irons absorb a change like this more easily. 2023 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Discussion and Links to Photos, 2023 The Honda Classic - Discussion and Links to photos, 2023 Genesis Invitational - Discussion and Links to photos, 2023 Waste Management Phoenix Open - Discussion and Links to Photos, 2023 AT&T Pebble Beach Pro-Am - Discussion and Links to all photos, Fitness, maximum efficiency for the time spent. Currently I play a set of old-school Ping Eye 2s, which I love, but I want the benefits of modern irons and forged heads. Its taking up to 2 degrees off each iron. The average golfer hits a 7-iron to around 30 yards from the pin. TM TP UDi #1 w/ Diamana Potentially, this would mean the toe digs in and your shots go right (right handed). It is a combination of those factors to get consistent results. A flat lie angle is simply when the heel of the golf club is bent so it is higher than the toe. And you are right about the irons listed, X Hot is a shockingly low launching iron and the G25 would be the exact opposite, with Rocketbladez mixed in the middle. The bounce on irons is pretty much a non starter in my opinion. I wouldn't feel comfortable messing with the bounce/offset/loft. That's what I did with my 4i: took out the 95 gram KBS shaft and replaced it with a 75-gram SteelFiber 780 HLS hybrid shaft. The Topgolf Blue Flag Challenge: Can you go 5-for-5 from 155 yards? With the high bounce level of the stock G30's, losing some of that bounce by bending it strong is no sweat, but plenty of clubs have so little bounce that bending them strong leaves virtually nothing left in the bounce department, but bounce really only helps if you strike the ball a little on the fat side. I think it depends on the player and his swing. The Wedge Guy: What really makes a wedge work. Arnold Palmer Invitational 2023 (*** NO LIV DISCUSSIONS/REFERENCES ***), Custom Ping i230 5-UW KBS Tour R+ Power Spec, G425 3 wood with GD TP, Ping Kaili Shaft,King Tec Hybrid, Jaws Raw & Zipcore Wedge, Airmax 97, Apex UW. there comes a time when too much loft jacking is too much. ENTER NOW! What still kills me are the guys coming in and demanding a lower lofted driver thinking it will give them more distance. You can also bend the angles to a consistent specification precisely fit for any golfer. Titleist 620 MB 5-9 Oban CT 125 Bubba might better be able to answer that question, I know you can with the mb or cbs. Justin Rose posts mysterious custom JR irons on Instagram. Each one of those sees him rightly disputing the market number one, but Im not sure I can get involved at around 20-25-to-one with any of the favourites, even if they hold excellent claims. would 2 degrees be too much and change the club's characteristics too much? It is a taylormade udi 2i that I want to bend from 18* to 16*. Any knowledge on the subject would be appreciated. traditional lofts ftw (let the technology be what determines added length/distance, not loft changes). This will reduce any penalty shots and subsequently the number of doubles-or-worse in your round. If jacking with strong lofting one you need to have a good fitter/ instructor work with you on your model suggestion and what will fit your swing. Thank you for such an eye opening article. I have to explain that the design allows the iron to have a stronger loft. Being a golf club designer and marketer, I certainly know that there are gains to be made in your efficiency by availing yourself of the right modern equipment. I'm guessing it will dig more but how much more? NOW AVAILABLE: GolfWRX G/Fore Hats and Holderness & Bourne Polos! Routinely, I notice longer than standard 85g shafts with these sets. If my hands are 2" farther back or forward at impact that is + or - 3*. There was only an added 2 yards with the stronger lofts of trackman. Some get more spin, some less. But the end result for an iron fitting is the same: I want the customer to leave with a set of irons that produce the best possible launch conditions for them. The drop off in make percentage from 3-6 feet and 6-9 feet is huge. I was being fitted for MP-4's and the ball flight with the kbs tour x was a little higher than i wanted so my fitter was able to bend it strong incrementally by 1 degree to flatten out the ball flight for me. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Strengthening the loft should decrease the effective offset shouldn't it? In some cases "craftsman's" marks on the hosels may result from bending them to the required loft / lie. Haven't registered for Team Titleist yet? Machines that adjust for all hosel positions, such asMitchell Angle Machinesare accurate regardless of the offset or hosel design of the golf club. It is hard for some golfers to understand how irons with more loft can help them hit the ball farther, and this is understandable. Is that ok? This puts a 5 iron at 60* and that is way too flat for most people. Titleist Vokey 47* Oban CT 125, 51*, 55*, and 59* Shimada Tour Wedge Black Clear editor. Haven't registered for Team Titleist yet? Generally bending lofts on irons unless you are tweaking them to even out a gap. I play high bounce Ping G30's and have bent some of the clubs in that set that strong. Add in the added forgiveness of modern irons, and you have a winning combination. Bending strong 2* decreases bounce by 2* and increases offset by about .75mm. March 27, 2015 at 11:41 AM TM TP UDi #3, MC 4-7, MB 8-P w/ Tour V S+ Adams A12 19 - Fuji HB 80X, PXG 0311X 4 - HZRDUS Red 105 X Offset degrees especially with a long iron can be a factor along with sole design. The ball came out much higher and shorter, just like you would expect from a 63*. PXG 0311P Gen 3 - 5to PW - Nippon 125 X My old callway x forged dug more than my bent mp-4's. Strengthening loft also increases the offset of the head. The main reason it is done on GolfWRX is so people can brag how far they hit their irons, generally with a passive brag. But, as lofts are strengthened the gaps become compressed on the long end and widened on the short. 16,822. I always found it a bit strange that I could be 20-40 yards ahead of some friends yet hit the same distance with mid to short irons. Ok thats good to know, the longest iron I carry in the bag is a 6 iron so it wont make that much of a difference then in the long irons. Upload or insert images from URL. Because of my forward foot was so much above my trail foot, my hands were a good 6" behind the ball, when compared to a level lie. The one with a ballflight too high, is delivering the clubhead Production Manager Wesley Turner: Five Years in the Bag. My advice is to get fit as cheaply as you can and find some newer distance irons on Ebay or BST that can fit you. Lots of good comments here. Callaway Epic - HZRDUS BlackCobra F9 3 Wood It would decrease the bounce on each club, not a good idea, as well as it would cause the ball to go farther. I couldn't agree more, they are a thing of beauty but also of art, it'll change the effect the way the club goes through the turf, I've lost some distance using these because I was hitting the new T-MB which 3 iron went a mile, but the 3 iron in the MB's is what dreams are made of, way easy to hit and launch, I wouldn't want to mess with it, that being said I did increase the lie up 2 degrees for my swing:). You are also all correct in that it is a long iron. With added ball speed comes more launch. After the death of his mother, Endycott understandably struggled through the late teens, understandably saying that, At the time, golf didnt really matter to me.. However, in reality it was now a 63* wedge so what happened. The concern is that all the fitting carts only have 6 irons and with the gaping on the 3, 4 and 5 irons lonely being 3* I am concerned on irons would react to my adjustments. The reason this happens has to do with an iron's center of gravity (COG), because when you lower an iron's COG you add a lot of potential height to a golf shot. In 11 starts since gaining his place at the top level, the 26-year-old has made four cuts, including a first-time-out 12th at the Fortinet, 10th in Bermuda (led after a first round 62), 22nd at the American Express 7th after day one) and top-30 at the Plantation Course last week. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. The trajectory, depending on your swing, should be flatter. Not every iron or wedge can be bent. When my first 'proper' set of clubs (MP30s) were done - at the same time as a Driver Shaft fitting - a couple were out considerably (the 6 iron had the loft of a 5!)! I have a 17-degree 4-wood, a 21-degree hybrid, a 26-degree hybrid, and a 29-degree iron as my longer (non-driver) clubs. A good tune-up is a good tune-up regardless of the final loft gaps. If the hosel design and manufacturing processes allow it, the lie of an iron can be bent 3-4 degrees or more with no compromise to the integrity of the head. I dont want the extra length added to the shaft plus the x7 2i shaft I have for it is the last x7 shaft i have. GolfWRX_Official Grant is a big-hitter off the tee, his driving distance ranking being fourth at Bermuda, 16th at the RSM and third at Pebble Beach, whilst he ranked highly for both his driving and greens during his KFT campaign. Just curious but, can I bend a set of titleist cb718 to the titleist ap2 718 specs? So going 2 strong will remove 2 degrees of bounce. APPLY NOW: Cleveland Frontline Elite Putters! I believe that you can't really bend your irons too much but to accommodate I am thinking of bending my AP2s 1 degree stronger and AP3s 1 degree weaker so that I have better gaping. Thanks for your advice, its been helpful. You won't notice it.
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